Relatable podcast 

Dr. Liz:
Hey, welcome to Relatable Relationships unfiltered. Sometimes we feel like dating should just come naturally, but we really all do need a little help. And joining me today is Barry Jenkins, psychotherapist and dating coach. And I am super excited for this episode because she's going to be giving us her top tips from the dating playbook. This is relatable relationships, unfiltered, breathing. You so much for joining me. I love your content. We met on Instagram and I am so excited to have you here.

 

Bree Jenkins:
I am so excited to be here. I love your content as well and I love talking that juicy realm of dating. It's just full of like all the best stuff.

 

Dr. Liz:
Absolutely. As especially when the person across from you as a complete should show when it comes to dating. I will give you tons of material to be able to dissect and help with, so I appreciate that. But yes, so that's a lot of the work that, you know, I do as a relationship. I'm an intimacy expert, is I do I help a lot of my clients with that dating process. And, you know, they say those who can't do teach or something like that. So I have all of those, you know, tips and tools and everything like that. It is definitely different when we implement it for ourselves. How did you get started as a dating coach?

 

Bree Jenkins:
Yeah, you know, my my origin story as a dating coach is kind of interesting. My first client was actually my sister, so after I had graduated from my master's program in therapy and like, clinical psychology, marriage family therapy, me and my sister were both looking for a job and I went home to New Orleans and I was like, Sis, let me help you with your love life. You know, I'll get us like the best dates. This whole summer time. And she was kind of like, super smart. She went to Stanford when she was like 16. So she really didn't have, like, the traditional dating history or skills. And so I helped her out and she met her husband and her husband, and they've been together like 12 years now, two kids and all, you know, all the things. And then I helped a friend of hers out and and a third friend. And I was like, you know what? This is kind of a skill that's a little bit outside of my my school training skill sets. And so ever since then, I have been in the business of helping people find love.

 

Dr. Liz:
I love that. That is great and so cool when you recognize that you kind of have that the niche that that special. Yeah. Where where do you think that your approach kind of differs when it comes to to being a dating coach? And then I know you kind of part of even on your bio you talk about how do you word it that it's dating good like basically to get the ring is kind of how what's your yeah.

 

Bree Jenkins:
I'm the the dating coach with the diamond touch is what I say Wow so in terms of like I think just because so many of my first clients wind up getting married, I realized, I'm really great at this base of people who want to date super intentionally with the goal of like a really healthy long term relationship or marriage. And so I combined a lot of different elements. I was like, I'll never fully abandon my therapeutic background. It's just too valuable of, you know, psychological nuggets and whatnot. But I think the practical pieces of like, how do we show up when we're on the dating market and how we flirt and, you know, what's the feminine energy piece? And like, how do you use communication to get the things that you, you know, the things that you want out of partners and have that land differently? I think all of those pieces wind up combining for people to have like the long term relationship in marriage.

 

Dr. Liz:
Yes. Yeah, no great points. And I think that the biggest barrier, which is definitely my biggest barrier, is not making time for it. So not not, you know, putting myself out there, not carving out the Friday or Saturday night so I can spend my time doing that. And I know a lot of my clients, that's what they struggle with as well. And the accountability piece goes a long way to have someone you're checking in with every week to, you know, like what? What efforts are you putting towards this? How are you actually putting action towards it? Because I completely agree. My my role as a therapist is my passion. I absolutely love that. But there is something just different and fun about the coaching aspect of it's a different world and a different conversations. So I agree that I enjoy both because of that. When you are starting at working with somebody and you're like, Okay, first thing we got to get exposure. We've got to, you know, find out what your options are. Where do you start with that? Do you use or suggest they use the dating apps suggest to go local and organically? Where do you start now?

 

Bree Jenkins:
I mean, well-rounded dating plan? You know what I think can make 40% of couples start online now. And I just tell people you don't want to leave 40% chance on the table. You know, it's kind of like having saying you want a job, but you only want a network for that job and you don't want to do any searches or look what's already published out there. This is not a good plan. You know? So I always encourage people to do both. You know, for some people, it's just much more comfortable to be in person. And I totally get that. And I think the best dating point is combining both elements. So I never tell people to abandon their networks or mixers or, you know, going out to lounges, bars, clubs, hotels, whatever your favorite kind of places are to find the best catches. I absolutely love pounding the pavement. I actually met my husband in person in Los Angeles and it was kind of intentional because I would partner with girlfriends and we would have ladies fun night. And the goal was, we're going to go out, we're going to go to a new place, are going to wear cute stuff, are going to have fun no matter what. But we're going to break off into teams of two and try to meet like nice eligible guys at these places. So there was kind of intention behind it. And I think the combination of using the online resource to meet new people that you normally wouldn't meet thinking about when you go out having that intention of like, let's show up to places we've never been to the parts of the city that we don't normally go to. It winds up giving you the most amount of opportunity. So I never tell people to abandon ship with online because I have so many clients that have their spouses from online dating.

 

Dr. Liz:
Absolutely. Yeah. And I would agree that the more options people have definitely the better my of lately with the dating apps as I was like I wonder if I don't have. Well there's a few reasons I don't have luck on there but partly I think it's I'm like I wonder if the type of man I would be interested in wouldn't use a dating app. And so that is kind of like on my mind, just as I'm looking at some of these photos of like the way that maybe I like to read this shit that way that I know the photo you're talking about. Yeah, the way they're posing or like what they're. And I'm like, Yeah, I don't think I would date somebody who's, like, posing everywhere with their shirt off or, you know, various things. I could go down the list and I will not. But some of I'm like, I just don't. But then the other people who are kind of more shy it that hard to get a feel for like who they are. Yeah that's been my I What are your thoughts on that.

 

Bree Jenkins:
I mean I really urge a very general approach around dating, especially if you're dating like pretty like straight men. Like. So here's a thing. The online profile game is like, there was no one got handed a manual look. Like this is how you do a group profile Like there's all these things on how to do a resume and I don't know if you've ever checked people's resumes, but people are not reading that either, because the resumes are crazy, too. Right? And that's why sometimes people are like, I've been sending it out and no one calls me. It's like, your resume is terrible. Yeah, it doesn't mean that they're a bad employee or that they don't have skills. It's like they don't know how to market themselves. And so when we're online dating, it's really essentially you need to know how to market yourself. If you go to Instagram, you look at people's profiles. People don't have businesses. Most people don't know how to market themselves. So that's what you're like encountering when you're online is and I check these profiles all the time of of my clients who are daters. And I have been like, why would we make you pick this feature? And I thought, you make me look funny. And I'm like, No, you're like so much more, you know, polished and sophisticated and beautiful or whatever the adjectives are that are the things that people are looking for than the picture. Sometimes people choose for themselves. So I really try to encourage my daters, like, you know, like if it's a five or above, just swipe. Swipe. Yes. And all it is is a door. It's opportunity for the person to show up differently than maybe the picture present. Yeah, of course. If it's ridiculous. No, but sometimes it's like on the it's on the cusp where you're like not totally turned off, but nothing about it is telling you that this is your person. Why don't you just create the opportunity to be surprised, right? You don't have there's not this low stakes, just like maybe this personal surprise me, because certainly my sister's husband definitely had one of the worst. I like in his car with, like the camera angle up his nose and his own picture that he had. But he's like such a lovely guy, so much more attractive than the picture that he put out there. And I literally told him, No, no, no, no, no. Save him. Like, maybe he'll be nice.

 

Dr. Liz:
Yeah. Yeah. So she met him then on. Yeah, yeah. Okay. I'm on that. That's and he only had one photo and one photo. Okay. See, so that's interesting because with my clients I am often like, if somebody only has one photo, like we're not really going to spend much time there. So I just know like the amount of people that are on there would be so like, there's got to be some, some barriers in place, some kind of like guidelines. But what we're not going to engage with, what are what are your guidelines when it comes to that?

 

Bree Jenkins:
Yeah, I think what I'm not going to engage with anything that seriously brings any raises or hackles, Right. You know how sometimes people have like the really like creepy dark picture that maybe they're not like super sable by. Right. Anything that's super offensive by anything that seems wildly inappropriate by if it's absolutely again a turn off by but if it's just this is kind of like not giving me the the sparkles right It's just a person who just put a profile up but there's nothing offending you. Then you can just say maybe. And then that person, the onus is on them to like, send you a message that impresses you. And my sister says, We did send her a message that impressed a lot, sent her a complete sentence that was, you know, grammatically correct. And that is effing impressive. Her actually like showed interest and chatted and then said, I'd love to call you and take you out to dinner. So, like, pleasantly surprised. So I always tell people like, you know, everything doesn't have to hinge on those on those pictures in words. It's it's just not the most practical. Most people really just don't know how to how to market themselves. And I've worked with lovely people that are introverts or, you know, they're very stable. They barely have social media. They're like the salt of the earth type of people. And they have some of the worst profiles, but they're great catches in terms of partnership.

 

Dr. Liz:
Right? Right. And so that that leads to my other difficulty with dating apps is that I am way more attracted to to energy, to a buy to conversation. Definitely Sabio sexual so intellectually and you know demonstrate your emotional intelligence, all of that. And so when you're looking through your pictures, you're not picking up on that for sure. But I love what you're saying about then allow them to start a conversation, because that is something I definitely suggest for my clients as well. I like to have the give them the opportunity to say something that might be intriguing, where the conversation goes. And a lot of that was a red flag, so to speak, can come up pretty quickly as well, because when they're giving them what word answers when they're not asking any questions, that's pretty telling. Really?

 

Bree Jenkins:
Absolutely is telling. It's low effort. You know, like it lacks intention. It's pretty boring is also why I try to tell people, like when you do make a connection online, try not to stay in the app too, too long just because the app is lacking in so many of the physical information that we get when we're standing in front of somebody like, you know, the first probably 2 minutes of standing in front of somebody being like, Hey, hey, what's your name? my name is Brianna. All of that feels stimulating because I'm looking at you. Maybe I can smell your cologne and I'm like, person tall and all the things all my it's just stagnant, you know? So, so much of the experience that we're looking for is from like, our evolutionary perspective of wanting to immediately feel chemistry. But when you're in the apps, it's like a different game. You're basically reading a resume and trying to build fire from there. So, you know, I encourage people to try to have fun with it, try to see if the person sends you something a little bit stimulating, but like, don't stay on the text game too long because it's going to nine times out of ten, it's going to shrivel up and die.

 

Dr. Liz:
Yeah, for sure. And that is definitely something I suggest often as well, because that the back and forth, I agree when there's no when you don't really know who you're flirting with, you don't really organize like it's not going to create a whole lot for you. So let's say we then move. So whether regardless of how they meet them, you know, out in a battle or on the app and we move to the first date, what are some do's and don'ts for that first date? So I would love to talk to you there. So yeah, because that's this is where I see. And so what you're describing earlier of like your client showing you the picture and you're like, like why when I have conversations with some of my clients about the first dates and I'm like, why? Yeah, I Where do you start with your do's and don'ts?

 

Bree Jenkins:
So I'm very hands on. I make my daters pick out their first three outfits so that they're just on repeat because I don't want you to show up anxious, trying, you know, the day of trying to figure out what you're going to wear because that like, builds anxiety. And, you know, sometimes, especially as a woman, you're like, well, you know, like I'm wearing it like, just like a wrong energy to start things off with. I'm like, pick out the outfits, know that you look good in them. It's seamless. You don't have to think about it. Try not to do super extended dates, like sometimes people do a little too much. That first date, they're getting like four, six, 8 hours. Like you're drinking the whole time. It's going to be too intimate. It's going to be awkward at some point. It's just way too much. Keep it short like a two hour date is great. Some people really hate the coffee date. And I get you know, I get it like I was not I was not a coffee date, girls. You know, I would always do like a very gentle period of like, I'm not really much of a coffee girl, but I'm totally down for, like, drinks and bites. And then you might go to and the majority of men would be like, okay, cool. You know, if somebody ever offered me drinks, I would just be like, drinks and bites sound great, but I'm a lightweight, so I've got to have something. Otherwise it's going to get crazy. Or I would say something kind of cute, you know, And then they'd be like, sure. So I think you should always and go for the type of date that you want so that you're most comfortable. Because when you're comfortable, it's much easier to be in your feminine energy. And when you're in your feminine energy, you can flirt. You know what? So it's like if you're all excited and annoyed before you even get there, like it's really hard for the date to blow the way they not realistic. Go Yeah.

 

Dr. Liz:
Yeah. And that's so true because anxiety is at the root of irritability. So when we are, it does manifest as annoyance or just maybe being more standoffish, not being as friendly or free flowing. So I agree and I love what you're talking about in terms of the length of the first date that is so important. And I went on a date a few months ago and we the first couple of hours, like we had sushi, we had drinks and stuff like that, and it was so much fun and I was interested and I was intrigued and then close it up by asking to go like, get something after. And I'm like, okay. And so like, we went to get another drink after and I'm like, okay, now we're going on our three like three and a half. And I'm like, Now I'm bored by you, By the way. We would have just been done at like the two hour mark. I probably would have got a date, but because it was dragged out in that way, I'm like, Yo, ADHD data over here is not trying to hang out for three or 4 hours.

 

Bree Jenkins:
Yes, yes. Is it easier to. So it's like we like I'm going to get distracted or sometimes your your social battery runs out or a lot of day after work. Right. And we're not keeping track of like it's been such a long day and so much has happened and I'm tired and it's normally my bedtime or whatever, and you can kind of just skip over all of that if you stay in the guide rails, which is what I tell my daters, like, you know, the rails are there to keep you safe. So it's like, do them. And of course, as you get to know someone like the one, like you can build the type of relationship that you truly want. But like those first dates, try to stay in those like easy rules. Same thing with, like, drink limits. I'm big into like, try not to drink more than two drinks on the date just because, like, as alcohol comes into play, the inhibitions get lower and like, the jokes start flying and there's just so much more room and opportunity to make a faux pas.

 

Dr. Liz:
Yeah, no, that's. That's a really good. So yeah. So being aware of the time limit, being aware of number of drinks, I think that those type of boundaries are also really fantastic to have in place because if you identify those, you set those. The way that that person receives those or on them is so telling of how to move forward with that. Because if they can't receive the boundary which we've all been there. Yeah, so annoying. That is one of the biggest, you know like there's no just a little longer or, you know, whatever the case.

 

Bree Jenkins:
Is like or bargaining already on the first date.

 

Dr. Liz:
Right. And then it's like, okay, so that's very telling. Like if they have no problem doing that the first time you're going out, that is a glimpse into the future if you continue that.

 

Bree Jenkins:
So 1,000%, I always tell people, like if something makes you really uncomfortable, go ahead and say like, this, this, you know, it make me really comfortable if blah, blah, blah. And if that person responds in a nasty way that is giving you so much red flag energy that you need to get on out of there, It's it's it's true. Like, if because people show up on first date trying to be the best version of themselves, the most considerate version of themselves already. Yeah. They're willing to risk being like a jerk.

 

Dr. Liz:
Right. Which they might wear as being a jerk, which is the even bigger concern.

 

Bree Jenkins:
Because it's like, so like you even lack self perspective of how this is coming across.

 

Dr. Liz:
Right? Yeah, that's very important. So let's talk about flirting, because it's really interesting that a lot of people struggle with flirting like they don't either. They don't know how to, they don't really know what it looks like or they just feel really uncomfortable trying to do it. And I've empathy for that because that would be like you you kind of want to build that chemistry, you want to gauge the interest, but you're like, I don't know how. So let's talk about like, what are some things that you might suggest when it comes to what? Also, let's put some, I guess like even guidelines around what flirting is and what flirting isn't. Yeah, I think sometimes when people don't know how to, then they just don't do it at all. And sometimes when you when they take it to like a really immature juvenile place. Yeah. So turn off.

 

Bree Jenkins:
Yes. The immature juvenile places where we do not want to. And I'm not.

 

Dr. Liz:
Seeing my friends.

 

Bree Jenkins:
The way that I like to think about flirting, or at least the way that I like teach a lot of my daters is fun. Fun, kind of frisky light energy, not super sexual, not super aggressive. Right? It's just fun and playful and maybe a little mysterious or maybe a little. Come here. Do you want to give me, you know, like this? A little coy? A soft hand with the flirt is much better than a heavy hand. And I always talk. I do like an assessment where we talk about, like, what is your intuitive flirt style? Like, I have these names that I'm like, are you a friendly visitor? Are you like a vixen, flirt, or like, are you like Jennifer Aniston or you like Angelina Jolie? Both are great. They both get the same hot guy, you know? But like, you just need to know which one is easier for you to kind of lean into, Right? But I think for a lot of people, what I find is getting them to be more of a friendly flirt is the easiest one because we all have a lot of social programing of what it's like to be friendly. Yeah, and, you know, it's just like kicking the friendly up a little bit, maybe touching the person very lightly on like the green areas, right like the shoulder that now arm that, you know, maybe yellow area, the the thigh, right touching the hair, lots of eye contact, laughing easily. All of these are like classic flirting techniques that actually work. But you do have to practice it. And what I find is, like, sometimes the biggest piece for people is about getting in that right energy, which is why I spend so much time talking about when you get to that date trying to be relaxed and trying to think of it as like, you know what, we're going to have fun no matter what because I'm here. There's food and drinks as about to peer. And, you know, I'm curious, you're not a person. We're just going to have fun no matter what. And when you get into that mindset, it is a lot easier to flirt.

 

Dr. Liz:
Yes. Yeah. And I think that really for that first day going into it with that mindset, that there is no expectations here, like we don't have to be future spouse. You know, there doesn't have to be a commitment. Just have fun in that first one. And that is really important. But I know that that's one of my barriers because I'm like with how busy I am and what I'm on just constantly, which I get. Everyone is busy, but like take it to another level. And so with that, I'm like, okay, well, if I'm not going to marry this person, which by the way, I would never get married again anyway. But if I'm not going to have a long term commitment with this person, why am I even going out to drinks with them? And I'm that's the mindset that I'm.

 

Bree Jenkins:
I suppose, like all or none.

 

Dr. Liz:
Yes. And I've got to be like that is definitely going into the new year. I am I am setting some intentions for this, but that, that is one of them. It's like, just go have fun because I do have a couple of guy friends that I won't be serious with. But we do hang out and we go on date ish type things that we know. It's not like I don't have interest in going further, but we still we have a lot of fun when we do that. And so I try to have that mindset that like you can just go hang out and have fun.

 

Bree Jenkins:
Exactly. You can just go out and have fun. And honestly, when you turn it super low, stakes of like, are here going to have fun, like let's just talk in life and I'm going to practice my, my flirting skills so that when I do get to the good one, you know, to the one, right, I'm like a top flirt her. I think it honestly makes it so much easier and you wind up increasing your chance of meeting the person on the line. So that's like the other card I think people face. Like the better you get at flirting, the more likely you'll be able to meet your person in person just because you have the right you know, you're putting out the right vibes and energy to like, pull that person to you.

 

Dr. Liz:
Yeah. How do you suggest for people to practice their flirting? So like, are you saying just in real time or do you have them even by themselves? Is there, you know, with a mirror or something like that? They're watching their own body language. How do you help with that?

 

Bree Jenkins:
Well, when people like enroll so in my course and they do want to work with me, we'll have like a flirting session while we're practice and I'll give them, like, feedback on, like, their body and stuff. And I also drop into flirting just to show people what it's like. Like if I'm talking now and then I'm like, So we know that you are very interested in talking to me. More people like, snap. Like she turned it on. I'm like, Yep, you can turn on, you can turn off so people can see that it really is just a skill that you have to that you access. And then like, yeah, like practice. I tell people, practice on everyone, practice on babies, on dogs, on old people, on people that you're not attracted to because the stakes are really low there. Yeah. And it starts to become fun because you're recognized that like, flirting really is just a type of like high vibrational energy and people respond to it even when there is no romantic attachment. Like, yeah, you can flirt with the store clerk and they'll be like, Have a great day. You know, they'll be really happy and there's nothing there. But now you, you're better at that skill.

 

Dr. Liz:
Yes. Yeah. And I one of the pieces of homework I just gave a client recently is just even just start conversation and, you know, I gave him X number of people for that week but just to start conversation. So when he's out and about practice striking up a conversation, no matter how random it is, no matter who it's with. But when you're going to hone that skill when you can and you and I as therapists and coaches in that way, like we could talk to literally anyone, anywhere and it's such a skill because when we're it lowers awkward situations like lowers the frequency of awkward situations. It we don't feel blindsided or caught off guard when we're, you know, forced to strike up a conversation. It's a really beneficial thing. And so when you think about translating that to dating, it and sometimes maybe the awkward low comes in on that first date or the first couple dates for you to be able to know how to then pivoted and transition. This thing is, yeah, it's a really good skill to have it.

 

Bree Jenkins:
Is it it. But I think the more you can have fun on these dates, regardless of the outcome, the easier it is to keep making space for dating.

 

Dr. Liz:
Yeah. Yeah. So then when we. Okay, we found our person, we went on a camping I well, I guess first before we go on a couple of dates, let's talk through. How do we decide if we even want a second date? Like, do you encourage that? You give everyone X number or do you. Yeah. Wired's like, what strategies to use for that.

 

Bree Jenkins:
Well, okay, so this is where it gets tricky because like when I work with people, it's always about breaking whatever the pattern is. So if you go out all the seconds, no matter what, then I want you to start being more in tune with like you already know, you already know. So listen to it, right? Don't do it. But for most people, what I find most people are not going out on all the second dates. They're they're not the like permissive ones. They're usually more like, no one is working no matter what. Or I just didn't have enough butterflies or just wasn't off the charts. I don't want to do it again. Those are the people that I'm like, if if nothing blew up right again, nothing crazy happened. There were no obvious still dealbreakers or and it was just a straight date and it was cool. Like they I kind of like them, you know, go out on the second one because sometimes on the first date one or both of you all are in your head or a little nervous. And as long as you have progression from date to date, then it's like a green light to the next the next, you know.

 

Dr. Liz:
But yeah, yeah, the more incredible you feel with each other and then and allow conversation to go to different places and Yeah. Because often that first and even the first couple you are trying to show up as your best self, which is just natural, but that also may prohibit or inhibit you from showing certain sides of your personality or talking about topics that are going to come up at the first date. So yes, that makes sense. And then even moving that into like commitment, how do you transition there in which obviously it's different for everyone? Sorry, but I know that that's for a lot of my clients. They talk about they kind of get in the limbo stage. Maybe they've gone on and full of dates and they like them, but they're trying to like, fill out the vibe on both sides.

 

Bree Jenkins:
Yeah, he moved less, less, less vibing in more strategic conversation at the right space. Yeah. Dating. Right. So if you are very sure that you want a, like, serious relationship or you want something that leads the relationship or leads to marriage, you do need to say it. I don't like heavy conversations on the first date per say. However, asking someone like, so what are you looking for is not that's not an off limit topic. Point is certainly for a lot of people who are dating like in their late twenties through their thirties and forties. Why the hell can't you say, What are you looking for? We are too old for these games, you know. And if anybody is like, the news on my neck or whatever, that is a sign that they are in games and probably a commitment phobia or whatever. Right. And you should take that as a sign of their emotional immaturity. So like, don't be afraid to just say like, what are you looking for? And I always tell people, if someone asks you what you're looking for and your goal is marriage or long term relationship, you can always say something like, Well, right now I'm very focused on finding someone that I have great connection with and spending time with. But ultimately I would love for it to lead to like a you know, like a healthy relationship. And one day I see myself getting married. So then you have your main focus, but you are not lying or, you know, turning marriage or relationship into a dirty word because like, if you can't even see it, how are you going to get it right? If an employer asks you, What are you looking for, whatever you got on tap, No, I want benefits.

 

Dr. Liz:
You know, like.

 

Bree Jenkins:
I want to make X amount more than my last relationship. And that's what I'm looking for. The only way that you're going to get it. So absolutely say it. And I think a lot of times if people have that conversation earlier, it sets the stage for when you're dating for you to more naturally say like, hey, I just want to have a check in of like, where is this headed? Because I feel like we're both on the same page of what we ultimately want. But I just want to make sure that, like neither of us are really off target.

 

Dr. Liz:
Right? Which is really important. It can be so hard in those initial conversations. I know a lot of people are kind of tempted to say, you know, whatever you have on tap, basically they're just like, you know, well, and especially if there is chemistry which can be so blind being so that when you're I am a proponent of chemistry. I know a lot of relationship experts like really warn against all the chemistry stuff because of what it's bringing up. I talk a lot about, though, that how we are programed we are that is what we are going to seek out. That's not necessarily a bad thing. We just have to be aware of if it is a bad thing, if it is impacting our mental health or well-being. But having chemistry is not bad. But we can't be blinded by that. So if we're like, Holy shit, he's so odd. I don't like whatever you want. I don't care. Like I'm down for anything. Okay? That's what leads to the situation. Shows that what's you know, it leads to us really being stuck in a limbo state that can go on for months or even years. And so having and like you said, at our age, nobody got time for that. So at this point, we've got to be really upfront and intentional with what we're looking for. And it's okay if you're if what you're looking for is not a long term commitment, that is okay too. But just being upfront about it is what matters.

 

Bree Jenkins:
Yes, exactly. Be upfront, have the conversation. Don't avoid the conversation. Sometimes we put our keep ourselves in a lot of pain by just avoiding a more direct conversation about what our needs are. And again, like you're teaching people how to treat you. So if you don't even honor your own needs by not opening your mouth about what it is you want, who is going to like search out to make sure that you're super satisfied if you can't even say what it is that will do every right.

 

Dr. Liz:
Right. And so being aware of your needs your wants, your boundaries, what what you're expecting out of relationships, what you're really needing out of relationships going into it. And I have. So when I work with my clients, I talk about all this this all the time, but the needs are the non-negotiables, the wants are the preferences, and then the boundaries are the dealbreakers. And those dealbreakers can be hard because especially when you're on the outs and you read through so many people and then you're like, okay, finally somebody knows. And I just ran into this like a couple of weeks ago. I'm like, okay, this is like he's six, five. He's a businessman, He's all these things. And then one of my deal breakers and I'm like, Shit, okay So I and I just have to I have been burned by this particular deal breaker one too many times. And so I'm like, I just have to I mean, I got to move on and not allow that. And so I think that that's so important for people in the dating realm, too, to identify those things and then honor yourself when it comes to them.

 

Bree Jenkins:
Yeah. I mean, I always do like a deep dive into the deal breakers versus the want to compromises and are the needs because sometimes I feel like people base their dealbreakers off of their trauma points versus their, like their deepest needs. Like if this happens it will destroy the relationship versus like, I've had this happen before or this sounds like a headache to me, right? Like sometimes people will be like, I've, I've, I've dated three men with kids and I just can't date anyone else with with kids. And I'm like, okay, so is it kids or is it high stress, high conflict, baby mama situation?

 

Dr. Liz:
Or is it is it the baby mama? I'm going to tell you that right now.

 

Bree Jenkins:
I'm like and they're like, no, it's the baby mama thing. I'm like, Is it primary parents that you're date or would you date someone who has their kids, you know, for three weeks or, you know, like once we get into the context of it, they're like, it's actually this key piece. And I'm like, okay, well, great. That's really the deal breaker versus just kind of snacking off the whole arm because you don't like the finger.

 

Dr. Liz:
Yeah. Now that's that's a great insight and so true and so getting clear out all of that. So then let's say you go through the handful of dates, you're feeling good and then you get the text that they're not feeling the same. where do we go? I go head north. So excited for where I was going with that. You were like, Was this where we jump into bed? No. Is where they break up. You know how people got to jump back from that?

 

Bree Jenkins:
You know, if it wasn't in alignment for them, it wasn't in alignment for you. That's just the truth of the matter. And you ultimately have to try to invest in that mindset, even when you're dating of like a very, like, abundant mindset and not such a scarcity one, because sometimes you really lock in on something that we think is for us. But if it's not for us, it's not for us. Sometimes it's not the right time and maybe it'll swing back around. But I think any time that happens, I usually like talk with daters about like, well, what were the positive nuggets that we can take away from this? Like, we can take away that there's somebody who likes us for somebody who had these qualities that we didn't think we would find and like. It did work for a while, but it just wasn't that right. Connection point. So sometimes there's like, there's like a really powerful piece as to why that was almost in alignment but not perfectly flush. And so I really try to get people to see that. Like most of the time it's a good thing because you don't want your time wasted. One of the worst things is when you love someone and they like you, but they keep you around because their place holding for when they find what they love. And so sometimes it's actually the the universe being very nice to us by not allowing us to a situation where we don't get to experience someone loving us as much as they love as we love them, you know? So I just try to frame it in a way where people can still trust that there's something else out there, but that this is probably actually a gift.

 

Dr. Liz:
Yeah. Yeah. Which feels really hard in the moment when you're being rejected and all of the narratives you create around that and all of your core beliefs that are so triggered and just completely activated. Because see, I'm, I'm not good enough, I'm not worthy, I'm not lovable. All the things, all the stories we tell ourselves and you're absolutely right that that is the perspective that no, because you are worth it, because you are lovable and because you are enough. You deserve a partner who feels that way about you. And so if this person not able to bring that to the, you know, to the table for you or whatever, then that is not that's not your fit. But I love what you're talking about with the abundance mindset. And I ended up talking I'm big into like manifestation and all of that. And I had three clients in a matter of like two days bring up this court, like it led to this concept of the that love really is abundant and but we don't look at it that way so often, right? Especially when we have trauma histories and we have that these early childhood experiences of not feeling chosen. And we tend to just hold on to whatever we can get on. But there's so much out there.

 

Bree Jenkins:
Yes, there is. And it's kind of like you should cultivate your mindset to always give you messages that there's more love out there. Like I try to minimize any like, content that makes me feel like I'm not worthy or, you know, I have to settle for scraps and I engage in a lot of content that shows me people are getting married every day. People are always finding love. Every shape, every size, every country, every year, no matter if there's a pandemic, a war, or whatever, it doesn't matter. Love is always happening. Every time I watch a show, doesn't matter if it's a show about extreme lifestyles that most people find undesirable, or it's this show just about like regular things. There's always a love aspect or people finding someone. So I take all of those little nuggets that just remind me, like Web is always available. It's evergreen territory. Yeah, millions of people, everyone wants love, everyone deserves love. And so it's really just a matter of time before it falls into alignment for you, as long as you believe that that can happen. So I'm like always cultivating that voice, and I do a lot of mindset work with my clients about raising that vibration up really high so that even when those things happen, it doesn't trigger that rejection wound as deeply, right? Because it's like it's not rejection, it's just me moving to the to the next iteration of the next person I'm supposed to be with.

 

Dr. Liz:
Yes, I absolutely agree. And I love that. Bree, where can people find you and so greatly appreciate all your insights today. Where can you be found? Websites, Social media, all of that.

 

Bree Jenkins:
There's all the things at the gathered life. You can find me on Instagram, at the gathered life. You can find me on Tik Tok, on all of it at the gathered life. My website is the gathered life. I would love for you all to connect with me, do lots of dating content, got all my fashion outfits. Everything is at the gathered life and I just enjoy being on the.

 

Dr. Liz:
Show and thank you so much. I am greatly enjoyed having you. Here is such a fun conversation and such good insight. So thank you again for hanging out.

 

Bree Jenkins:
Thank you for having me.

 

Dr. Liz:
Thanks again, Bree, for teaching us all how to date a bit better. And thank you all for hanging out on relatable relationships unfiltered. Make sure to subscribe to our YouTube channel, Sign up for my newsletter and find me on Instagram at Dr. Elizabeth Fedrick. This is relatable relationships, unfiltered.