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Dr. Liz:
I'm very ambitious. I work hard, I'm driven, and so I don't need somebody who can match that financially, but I need somebody who can match that from a drive perspective.

 

Jacob Lucas:
Let's say like a normal job, like they work in a supermarket. Would you say no?

 

Dr. Liz:
shit, Jacob, come on. On the app, I would say I. I would. Yes, I would move it along. I'm, like, turning bright red. So hopefully the HD on all this is like, we can edit that out later.

 

Dr. Liz:
This is relatable relationships, unfiltered. Hey, and welcome back to Relatable Relationships Unfiltered. We have a really fun episode for you today with dating coach Jacob Lucas. He is TikTok viral with all of his dating advice, and he's here to put me and my dating life on the hot seat. Jacob knows just how difficult relationships can be, and he's here to make them a whole lot more relatable. Jacob Lucas, the dating Coach. You are all over TikTok, Instagram. You're all all over the place with your dating coach strategies. How are you?

 

Jacob Lucas:
I'm very good. Thank you. Thank you for having me on the show. How are you doing?

 

Dr. Liz:
I'm doing well. Yes. I'm excited to talk today. So you came on another show that I host and we were able to talk through some dating tips and things like that. But I'm hoping today we will talk through the dating strategies, modern dating, the difficulties that are faced. And I was asking you before we started recording. So you're currently in a relationship.

 

Jacob Lucas:
I am. I am. I'm a very lucky man to have a wonderful, wonderful woman to be with. Yeah, I've been with now for just over a year. So, yeah, it all started in a very modern way as well. So it's I could definitely help. So yeah, it's a, it's more like integrated in modern web dating and how things like organically bloom, shall we say.

 

Dr. Liz:
Well what does that mean exactly. Go back.

 

Jacob Lucas:
It was how you met. We met through Instagram. Okay. So I think Instagram is my pathway to meeting new people now, isn't that like it shows your life, It displays who you are, whereas a lot of dating apps like some fantastic, but you only see a small, finite, finite amount of what that person has to offer you. So the pictures, cool by a great Instagram is a constant stream of your life. I feel like you get to know somebody a lot easier through that. So we met through Instagram, so she she she put some stuff up. She followed me for us like a couple of my stuff.

 

Dr. Liz:
Is that important to add in?

 

Jacob Lucas:
Like she put Psycho in stuff and then I just look at profiles like, okay, see this? Interesting. She's attractive so that she started liking a couple of things back. And then I just into the EMS, if you will. Hello conversation. I just come from the ready and then she's actually from America, not from England. So it's a very long distance sort of thing. Yeah, I'll just going to work. So then she come to England, stay with me for, for a little while and she comes, stay with me. And I was like, it's just perfect. Is it clicked? Like, no. When you meet someone and you think that's the 100%, it just clicks effortless. There's no drama, no, I don't think we've ever had an argument. It just flows perfectly. And then I come to New York in the back and forth. So we've got two houses. So. So I went to New York, so.

 

Dr. Liz:
That's how you're doing it. Okay. I was wondering about that because when we've talked in the past, I didn't know if you were in New York, So you guys, that is her your career. You can do virtually as hers as well?

 

Jacob Lucas:
Kind of, yeah. So shame, shame. She, she she can do remote. She works enough as well. But I'm fully remote so I'm literally just picking pick up my bag and go where I want to go. So it's really nice. So but New York is good. I, I prefer it to Well I was named and by a mile there's no city in the world like New York is a is a loft thing. But it's nice to go back to the countryside every so often as well because you. Yes.

 

Dr. Liz:
You have you have the best of both worlds, Literally.

 

Jacob Lucas:
Absolutely. But what about you?

 

Dr. Liz:
From where am I from? Yeah, I'm from California. So I grew up in California and then I've been in Arizona for almost 15 years.

 

Jacob Lucas:
I know the difference between California and Arizona dating as it being really different for you.

 

Dr. Liz:
Well, so I did not do a whole lot of dating in California, so I got married when I was 18 years old, so we moved from Southern California and then my ex-husband's job moved us to Northern California. So we were went back and forth between there. And then his job brought us out to Arizona. So we've been divorced for the last couple of years, but we have a 15 year old son together. So we because of that, we have a lot of family time and all of that. So I'm not really sure how the dating world differs, but I would imagine that it's probably a lot more entertaining in California.

 

Jacob Lucas:
You know, as I you know, it's like it's in the middle of nowhere. But it is. And she was actually having clients from Arizona and it has very they impose very, very small. Very, very small. Isn't it like his interest. Yeah, it's super interest. I get like people from America's main I mean you get from America, but I do get people from different places in the world. But in America, I, California seem to be very good for it. New York, the East Coast, New York is very, very good for it. But it's a different dynamic. Is it? The New York dynamic is very different dynamic to the rest of America. Yeah, but I am very happy for Arizona. They said it's nothing. It's just Bowers wasteland.

 

Dr. Liz:
Well. that's real hopeful. Thanks, Jacob. Yeah, not really, but Arizona is definitely just a different vibe. It's much more family oriented and it's just, you know, California and New York have the big cities and yeah, it's definitely different going back to the Instagram thing, though, I think that that is a really common approach that people and probably with your clients, you, you see that I would I would imagine and I like what you said because that's really accurate. When we use the dating apps, we have, what, five pictures to choose from, maybe a couple really corny prompts. And so you don't really get a feel for that person at all. But when you're watching them through a social media platform, you get a way better idea of like even their personality, what they do from day to day. In a lot of ways it seems like a more effective approach.

 

Jacob Lucas:
Absolutely. So it's like I always think how is dating apps your own dating apps get off to date, not just a goal. You go for it and you obviously want to get there. I was being get dating app and then get the Instagram. I'm not going to Instagram this day, right. Or the tick tock. Tick tock is great for like videos but is not really great for communication with each other. Like access to Instagram. But I actually think tech stocks are better off in my opinion, because it's just more entertaining. It's like the new thing. It's my thing. But Instagram is really good for connecting with people like, you know, in messages and whatnot. It's kind of like got the dating app straight onto there and then you can see about parts and is like in layman's terms, if that person is a weirdo or not right on dating app, anyone could be anyone you could just put, Yeah, I'm really nice and really cool, blah blah blah. Puts a nice pictures up. But on that Instagram you then start to see if that person is a good person or freak. Then you start to see like if it can be for you or not. They put where things in their story are entertaining, like actively activity, doing things their life. I think it's just it's just like a cheat code, if you will, to just see it and what people are like and see if they're good for you, I think as well, because you will see from a psychological background, you can you can tell a lot about someone's personality from that Instagram. yeah.

 

Dr. Liz:
For sure. I love when people put their Instagram handle like in their dating app because that's usually like a decision maker right there just to see. Yeah, because even you can be so selective with what pictures you put on the dating app. But then when you go back and look in. Yeah. Angles and lighting and there's that's all a very powerful thing. So you just get a very different idea of that person.

 

Jacob Lucas:
Yeah, I think without excuse excuse language being thousands of dickhead or not sure.

 

Dr. Liz:
How do you help your clients to kind of like what are some things you suggest they look out for when they're looking at somebody's social media app?

 

Jacob Lucas:
You know, what is it you can tell a narcissist from their social media a mile away. You can tell it my way. So let's say you match a good guy on a dating app. Hated it. No more, look cool, whatever. And then you go to his on his bus thing and unless he's a model, if he's a model, find that and go it's school. But if he's putting topless pictures on the time, he's really craving attention and his stories, he's craving attention. Like, do you think I'm I'm about whatever could be right. But you can always tell like if someone like let's say, for example, there's a beautiful view, beautiful view. And I see the camera in their face and block out the rest of you thinking why you do it. I always feel like it's, Why are you doing that? Why not appreciating that white subset of yourself? Right. Again, if you look at like as a result of you, a guy or girl, you can tell what kind of the kind of girl who just wants you attention. I point do you stop. So if you if you if you go on dating app and as a girl or guy and they have that Instagram handle in a dating app, that's not a red flag. It's an amber flag, in my opinion. Okay, In what way? Because a lot of people just going out to get followers. I know that. Yeah. I'm just going to get followers clicking that profile and just let you just pictures of them, like in very narcissistic kind of poses. Again, if your model was great, but you know, you can just get the vibe. Are you always I'm never wrong and I'm always what I can tell what you would like from your Instagram site.

 

Dr. Liz:
Well, I feel that way. Even what they post on their dating apps, I really do like put off by men who put topless pictures like on their dating apps because I'm like, if that is if that's what you're using, that's your main bait to draw somebody in. There's not a whole lot else going on. So the first like that's a total turnoff for me when you I assume, use dating apps prior to your relationship.

 

Jacob Lucas:
Yes yeah I did that was interesting experience option in that you went out for an experience right so I had a fun like I have a 400,000 tip so so people knew who I was a little bit in the community in the dating scene that I preferred to catfish. I was like, Well, I can't wait. I was like, This is I thought.

 

Dr. Liz:
You were.

 

Jacob Lucas:
Nearly 40. They didn't think it was me. And then I just kept you messing me. God, I was just actually you people like, you know, just like, have a conversation. But I don't that I was like, No, this is me. I And then. And then when I found the biggest, one of the biggest things was as well. People get really intimidated of the following and it means nothing. You know, you establish a bigger firm in Instagram, it means nothing. It's fantastic. People follow you, but it doesn't change who you are as a person. But a lot. Yeah, but a lot of people thought like I can't believe you actually talking to me. And it's like.

 

Dr. Liz:
What's interesting? Maybe we fall into the narcissistic category, then maybe people are like, put off by us when they get it, get over to our accounts.

 

Jacob Lucas:
Because a lot of like, you know, big accounts, for example, you do get a lot narcissistic people who are influenced by that followers. They get there's a lot of boss in influence industry by their followers to get a big thing. Like I can happily say how I've never even bought one right? You know. Yeah, exactly. So it's like a lot of people, they do buy their followers and they have seen so much and they are too good for people and not the message box. If you didn't bother and us like the the general consensus of like someone who is an influencer online is there a lot or is is about the reading.

 

Dr. Liz:
It really is.

 

Jacob Lucas:
Yeah, it's reading. Okay so I found a lot of single and dating apps they found out that that was that was definitely a weird hurdle.

 

Dr. Liz:
they were turned off then by when they would find that out, they assumed that you were a douchebag, that you were a narcissist, that you were all these things.

 

Jacob Lucas:
Because again, a lot of people want them to be their best. Never. People never will not. It means nothing. So I think people get chance. You think, okay, you're not you're not like, This is fantastic. But as well I found personally with myself on the because I'm a dating coach and again you must come across this lot people start intimidating or using these, you know theories on me Are you analyzing me? It was like, I'm not like I told you to have a conversation, but you must have thought all the time myself.

 

Dr. Liz:
absolutely. I have. So that's people's favorite. Well, I guess they use it in all different ways. Pick up line. But then also it's like showing their insecurity. But that is always like the question of me psychoanalyzing them. What am I thinking? What am I? Yeah. And that that gets exhausting for sure. Those pickup lines get really corny, really.

 

Jacob Lucas:
Pick up lines that you have.

 

Dr. Liz:
Well, I mean, just in that way when we're talking specifically to the psychology, it's in that way like, you must be psychoanalyzing or making jokes like that. Somebody was like, How how many times have you got the pickup line of like being a hot doctor or something like that? And I was like, No, bro, just you. You're the one that you had. He was like, You don't put me in that category. I'm like, No, but really? So I think people try to be funny with it, you know, like in an attempt to use that humor. But at the end of the day, it's just as important.

 

Jacob Lucas:
Do you find a lot of clients who have like doctorates, very accomplished, like academically or what in their job do you find being a doctor is a hindrance to they go.

 

Dr. Liz:
Well, I guess it depends what my goal was, quite honestly.

 

Jacob Lucas:
Do you find a lot of men rephrase that hindrance? Do you find a lot men get intimidated?

 

Dr. Liz:
I think that they do. And especially, you know, honestly, I when we're thinking about this from like modern dating, I think it's even beyond my credentials and it's about the success I have with my business. And so I think that that creates insecurity for some men, for the wrong men, though. And I think that that's how I look at it. If if men are going to be insecure about that, that's not the type of man that I would want anyway. But yeah, and I hear that you're saying that your what you even do as a living, that that created some issues. How did your girlfriend how did you convince her to look past that shall we say.

 

Jacob Lucas:
Was interesting when somebody asked you like gets like follow me for a little while and once somebody follows, they know you're not like that, if that makes sense, because it's like love. My concept is so like, for example, a lot of my stuff is helping people, so I'm not like, you know, I don't even have cameras on me. I don't you very rarely see me talk about video, talk about myself. I just don't like doing I just don't like it. I'm not interested about my sense. Yeah. Like my goal is to help people. And when people start seeing that, okay, Jenny, trying to help people has a nice energy about him, then it kind of what do that thing if you straight away when you know one thing that right single people don't see that side as they just look up to see the number It was sad. It was really stupid right. But that so I didn't really I didn't convince the chief what was really cool. So she thought was really cool. She's like, it's amazing, blah, blah, blah. But she she's a very, very, very, very successful woman. What she does. Anyway.

 

Dr. Liz:
So she was not intimidated?

 

Jacob Lucas:
No.

 

Dr. Liz:
So you intimidated by her?

 

Jacob Lucas:
No, I love it. I actually love it. Like, I'm glad she's fine. If we have an IQ test and she beat me by one point, I was like, one point. I was like.

 

Dr. Liz:
So what's that like?

 

Jacob Lucas:
Yeah, I see point. Like, you know what? You know? And then one point is one point you can go to over 300 points. It's like, yeah, you with the I mean, so she's modeling. Yeah, I mean she's very accomplished, which is great, but so I like that. But a lot of guys they don't do they they done it's like did do but that's why I thought the thing is one of the biggest things that I thought was a real crying shame and your clients as well then if you come across same thing but very highly hyperbolic women successful women could be support, academic job, whatever. Right. They always trying to downplay themselves. Like I find it massively so I knew women who like, you know, have a lot of money, for example, they hide it, they hide it or they have a very, very smart and don't themselves down a little bit because they don't want to get away on my that's the worst move you can make as to the worst thing you can do if you've had that yourself clients or.

 

Dr. Liz:
No, but that's an interesting point and I guess that really ties into that. Our societal influence of that, that there's these cultural beliefs of the man being in the more dominant role and that that so a successful woman that is going to feel often intimidating for a lot of men. And so that would make sense though. I mean, I could see that from the female perspective in that way of not wanting to scare partners off. But then I guess I agree that it's the worst strategy because when we think about it from a long term perspective, like is that really the partner that they want to they had to they had to shrink to to be with they had to show up as less in the world in order to get their approval. Yet seems like that would be highly detrimental.

 

Jacob Lucas:
It would be because like a lot of that race is going to play out. They're not going to celebrate your successes. Always want to fill that superiority complex view kind of thing. They're always going to have that over you. And I always say to these women, I said, Just be patient and the right guy will come along. But I found this my experience talking to people, men and women, that there's a lot more pressure on guys society to be more competitive now, like even more so you got like you see all these videos on Tik Tok or Instagram or YouTube and it's like you need a six figure man. They're going to go, I keep seeing this like associate a lot of videos, associate high value with money as more like.

 

Dr. Liz:
Who do you think is perpetuating those standards? Do you think it is the female population or do you think it's other other men putting it? Okay, what's your thoughts on that?

 

Jacob Lucas:
It's is both. But it's not the whole populace. It's not a whole populace, if you will, is both this. So if you go into like Tik-tok, YouTube, Instagram, the videos that get the views, all these videos, it's always the fucking ideas languish. It's always them who sat around a table like you. You can't get the guy because you're not a 1010 and he's a six figure man or woman. I want a six figure amount, blah, blah, blah and all this. But that's a minority. That's a very small minority. But they're the ones who get the views, get pushed out more, so then it gets ingrained into people. So guys like, I need this bigger man who goes with me and it gets really hyper competitive and it's like, that's one big thing I'm seeing from a lot of guys is like from clients and stuff and they go, I don't earn a lot of money. I don't do this like I'm not this. I'm not like, I'm like, means nothing. My what? What? Don't you support yourself? That's all that matters. Nothing else means anything else. Long as you're not like, you know, sit on seafood désormais as like, and have a level of ambition about you. So you need. You don't need anything else. But that's. That's. That's a massive thing I'm watching at the minute. It's getting worse as well. Like, well, I.

 

Dr. Liz:
Think that dating apps really make that worse. So I really struggle with dating apps because I've found myself to be incredibly judgmental on a dating app in a way that I wouldn't probably be or that I know I wouldn't be in real life. And so that's one of the struggles that I come across a lot. So as you're describing, whether it's the amount of money somebody makes or their esthetics or how they show up, I'm really quick to be like, Yeah, no, yeah, no, when it's on the app versus in real life, I, I'm drawn to people, I'm drawn to conversation, I'm drawn to intellect, I'm drawn to energy, all of those things. And so that's where I'm thinking that the apps have been completely ineffective for me. It's because just basing it on a picture, it's not going to really give you the insight of. And so then as you're saying all those things I am, I'm like, nope, not job. No, like not tall enough, not this, not that. But then I realize that's not how I show up.

 

Jacob Lucas:
So that's interesting. I'm dating app So does Joel make a difference on the look? They do make a difference when anyone says, look, do count.

 

Dr. Liz:
Yes. But I think that the distinction there that that people and I talk with my clients about this all the time when they say I feel shallow and it's not about that somebody has to be societally whatever it's that you have to be physically attracted to them. So I think that that that is the distinction that often gets missed is that and I'm attracted to somebody based on do they piqued my interest, Are they funny, Are they clever, Are they brilliantly smart, Like all of these things that, like, keep me drawn in? You're not going to find that on an app.

 

Jacob Lucas:
Yeah, I kind of agree. What you mean? It's not the kind of people.

 

Dr. Liz:
Wait a minute. Are we. Are you going to be my dating coach here for a second? I think this is a good approach.

 

Jacob Lucas:
This is so. So like when you say you're going to find out, like you mean there's not people like that on your app. We mean you don't have.

 

Dr. Liz:
A chance to get there. I have no patience to go sit at multiple dates. I think that dates are the cringes. Look, I would be the worst client ever that dates first dates are just so uncomfortable. I was telling another guest we had on the show recently that everyone wants to tell me about their trauma on first dates because they, you know, if they know what I do.

 

Jacob Lucas:
Biggest fucking red flag in the world.

 

Dr. Liz:
I agree. The biggest fucking red flag to me as well. And it is the most obnoxious thing. So I think that that's what starts to happen is that I'm like, okay, if you're not showing up perfectly here on this app with this profile you created, I'm not giving you a first date because I don't have the time or energy to do so. And so no, to your question, I do think there are probably tons of quality people on the apps. I'm incredibly judgmental so that nobody gets past that so that I don't have to be bothered by a date.

 

Jacob Lucas:
That's interesting. Okay, so let's say by now I say, look, I don't judge people for judging people in the way they look. You got fun a attractive and that you will have sex with them. But they point out boys book a job. Say, would you would you judge them on that job? I'd be honest.

 

Dr. Liz:
shit. Jacob, come on. I mean, okay, so here's the thing, though. So let me put my disclaimer on it.

 

Jacob Lucas:
I work for like this. I'll get into it.

 

Dr. Liz:
I work really hard at my career. I'm, like, turning bright red. So hopefully the HD on all this is like, we can edit that out later. I'm very ambitious. I work hard, I'm driven, and so I don't need somebody who can match that financially, but I need somebody who can match that from a drive perspective and somebody who makes their or their ambition their priority. And so then is that a more politically correct way to say, yes, I do.

 

Jacob Lucas:
Judge Yeah, So, so let's say, for example, if someone were, let's say like a normal job, let's say like just normal job, like they work in a supermarket, would you say no?

 

Dr. Liz:
Okay, but let's go back to if I met this person in life.

 

Jacob Lucas:
So I'm getting that is what I'm going.

 

Dr. Liz:
Getting on the app. I would say I would. Yes, I would move it along.

 

Jacob Lucas:
Why would you say no? Then?

 

Dr. Liz:
Because of my own biases, right? I mean, I'm completely aware. It's based on my own core beliefs of wondering, you know, okay, if you work at a grocery store, you have to at least be the manager of the grocery store. So at least I know that you have ambition. And again, it's not about their salary. I have to know that, like, they're going to understand my drive because I think that that when we talk about men being intimidated, it is. You are laughing at me right now.

 

Jacob Lucas:
No, I'm not a robotic. Let's go.

 

Dr. Liz:
perfect one once that people I think being intimidated by my success, but people get annoyed by how often I work. And so I need to know somebody who can understand that man. I am on the hot seat with this shit now.

 

Jacob Lucas:
I like this. Like, you know, the thing is, I don't judge you for this. I just think it's interested in like, if, if, if it is so, I so let's for example, I know people who, when they were younger I had them with jobs. It is myself for example. So let's say if when I was younger, like a lot younger, I used to work in a supermarket right? Well, I was like 18. I saw work in a supermarket.

 

Dr. Liz:
And I think you're putting that disclaimer in case you thought I was like, judging me or anything.

 

Jacob Lucas:
No, no, no, no. Anyway, Blessé, let's say, Yeah, I was 18. I was very ambitious. Very ambitious. 18. Okay. And then but that mentality could be in a 30 vote or 40 or whatever, right? But they might just be down on their luck. So they might have happened to, in where they might have had amazing business and then they got swindled for example. But they lost everything and they'd think, Crap, I need this is my step. I need to make, I need to I need to pay the bills and I'm going to work on someone else in my own time. And they might be a genius. And I was super smart, super ambitious and the nicest person you ever going to meet, but you also can pass up person before getting to know that story.

 

Dr. Liz:
On the dating app, but not in real life.

 

Jacob Lucas:
So what I'm.

 

Dr. Liz:
Saying around here, but yes, on a dating app for sure. But to be fair, I would be swiping past like the rock and roll, you know, all I would be because I would find something to judge. I think that comes back to like my lack of desire to actually go on a date with them. So, yeah. What do you see as some of the biggest self-sabotaging behaviors.

 

Jacob Lucas:
That I think should sounds like something like self-sabotage. You're not complete as a complete, like gouge out, freak out. No, no.

 

Dr. Liz:
Okay. So in addition to that, what else do you see.

 

Jacob Lucas:
The biggest self-sabotaging for me. I see. Do you think so? What would I say? The self-sabotage thing. I see what people are doing is a lot of people who've been cheated on, which is really unfortunate. Nobody did that. Right? Right. they, they basically project those emotions that they have on their partner who is loyal, who hadn't done anything because what was happening in the past that basically they're like they might be saying, they're cheating ahead. They might like think I'm going to mess this up to protect myself. But it all comes from how to with being true in the past. Like if they being someone's been disloyal to them. The French kind of like, you know, this stuff anyway. But it's like trying to get them out of it to protect them right away. So you might end up kicking off more. They might end up rejecting that they're going to cheat on the person, cheat on them as a of things. But I always find it comes down to how they were treated in the past relationship. Have you found that you so forth.

 

Dr. Liz:
Yeah, for sure and you know digging into childhood a lot and all of that, that definitely comes up in the self-sabotaging behaviors. And I agree. I see a lot of my clients when things are going too well, right? Because we're anticipating that it won't. And we so commonly here, they're just waiting for that other shoe to drop. And so often I see that people will create opportunities for it to drop because they assume it's going to happen anyway.

 

Jacob Lucas:
I always been like, well, like a lot people like the chaos.

 

Dr. Liz:
Yeah. Yes, Well, because their brains are designed like, designed for that. It's been programed in that way. So they do desire the chaos because of their programing for sure.

 

Jacob Lucas:
Yeah. It's like.

 

Dr. Liz:
Okay.

 

Jacob Lucas:
So as a lot of people like a lot of relationships fizzle out because they get boring because a lot of people don't know how to have a fun time, like for a high emotional time choice without making it controversial and said like, get the good feelings they being they embrace the bad because it's something that goes up and down but makes sense. Yeah. And people like like they got it from their parents in childhood. So it's my parents with childhoods and they've always had chaos. And again, like you're right, it might be going too well for them and they think, I can't do this, this just fuck this up. But what we say I do.

 

Dr. Liz:
Well, so when you talk about that, you and your partner haven't had any conflicts. If you had a client who was saying that that there was no conflict for like a year. What are what are your thoughts around? So I hear it's because you guys just really vibe and that for sure is going to contribute to it. Going well I think happens if you have a disagreement.

 

Jacob Lucas:
If we disagree, we talk about there's always been disagreements like, you know, but it's not many. It's not many. But we've had disagreements. But it's a lot. Evaluate the quantity. Never argue that with that partner. I'm like, the biggest thing I would ask is, are you submissive to your partner then? Or do you work out properly? Like can.

 

Dr. Liz:
Like.

 

Jacob Lucas:
Yeah. So you could be like, say for example, if my partner would dominate and I was like, Yes, yes, cool. Yeah, whatever you want. That's not healthy. That's bad, isn't it? Yeah. But if I'm like because I like, I do whatever I want that boy want and she does whatever she wants whenever she wants, but it's like it's a consideration factor as well I say because I'm proposing to go out when she's at home alone. I would probably go out my friend's night. She's not going to say no and vice versa. If she said, I got my friends night, I said date not just go. You know, it's not like there's no ego as well. Right. But makes sense. And no, it's never submissive to each other as well. So I would say it's not it's I think it's a great thing I suppose from George Clooney she'd have a date and someone's kicking us about it. He said that his marriage is amazing because the easiest thing in his life, I think, is if your marriage, marriage or a breakup is not the easiest thing in your life, you're in the wrong marriage relationship, in my opinion.

 

Dr. Liz:
And what does that look like to you? That it makes it easy? Like in what way? Well, because I think that it's normal for there to be for not necessarily to be easy. And I actually talk with my clients about I talk on my social media about that when we continue to perpetuate this belief that relationship should be easy, then I think what we're really doing is we're continuing this culture that ties into this other part of our conversation of as soon as things aren't going well, self-sabotaging, all of that, we just end it. And I think that that's what starts to happen with people who may be or are experiencing conflict more often because maybe they're going through a transition. There's something going on and there's an increase in conflict. And the thought goes to, okay, well, social media is telling me all the books are to everything, saying that if a relationship is not easy, it's not healthy. And that's concerning to me because there's going to be a lot of times when it's not easy. So I guess what is your definition? How are you defining a relationship? Being easy.

 

Jacob Lucas:
Though? I always think that is always going to be hard things that come across in life anyway. Let's say, for example, someone does a job, they might sit on my husband's the house or whatever, you know, happen. But if you start conflict with each other, let's say, for example, me and my girlfriend, this is stuff in life that pops up, I'm sure. But we never, ever blame each other. We don't get your name wrong. Or she goes, You're in the wrong. It's always how do we how do we get how do you solve this problem? You know, nobody raise their voice at each other. Nobody at all is like, yeah, but it sounds a bit weird as well. You might not think it's healthy, but I do.

 

Dr. Liz:
I'm not saying it's not healthy, but I think that the difference is you guys probably had those skills coming into it, right? I mean, you as a relationship dating coach like you clearly have skills beyond the average person.

 

Jacob Lucas:
Well, I was going to let it slide with her and me. We both know if if we were to disrespect each other, for example, she knows that she's taught disrespect to me. Be nasty. I'm gone. I am her. And she can be. And she's the same. She knows. I know that if I stop messing her about, she's gone and kind of like puts like that on like that. It's kind of like keeps you respectful. That makes sense.

 

Dr. Liz:
I think that's a great point. Yeah. Yeah. Because I think whatever the relationship, whatever becomes the norm is what both partners will engage in. So if the norm is to put each other down or to yell or to be disrespectful, and that starts to slowly happen and becomes adaptive, that okay, now this is just what we do.

 

Jacob Lucas:
Yeah.

 

Dr. Liz:
Then yeah, I think you're right. I think when there's an understanding of neither partners willing to tolerate that type of behavior, that really forces you to have to make a better, more adaptive decision in the moment.

 

Jacob Lucas:
And it sounds really weird, but one of the biggest things that I've learned is from I read a lot of philosophy, a lot philosophy. I knew what these people as smarter than all of us, like Aristotle's, the world of Plato's, that they make us look like chimps, basically. Anyway, So the reading of our stuff and one of the things that stuck out in our stories really, really stuck in my mind. I always remember I never, never, like, let myself get angry. Is anger always comes from a place of superiority, always for gusto. So if somebody gets angry at you, it's because they're trying to beat you at something. So let's say I mean an argument and then you start beating me. So no reaction as much. You will get angry. Don't, fuck you, blah, blah, blah, whatever, when the thing comes. Because then when you beat someone at something, you're superior to them. So anger is a channel for you to be superior over somebody else. That's what I read. So I always think every single time in my life and somebody's been angry at me or been angry at someone is because I feel superior to them or they felt superior to me. I'm trying to impose that superiority on that person. Yeah, and they're trying to do this. Would you agree about.

 

Dr. Liz:
I 100% agree. I love how you're putting that and I talk about that a lot. Like in that in moments of conflict, do you care more about being connected or being right? Because you can't have both. And so, like you're saying, when we get angry and so it's because we're trying to be right. But as soon as somebody is superior, as soon as somebody is deemed right in that situation, there's a natural discord that takes place because you're no longer you're no longer next and you're no longer allies or on the same playing field. Somebody has just been given a level up, and that means somebody inevitably gave a level down. And that's a divide.

 

Jacob Lucas:
100%. I think like a finger intelligence constant is a big factor as well. I think you've got to be on the same wavelength, like, let's say, for example, if you're playing intelligent, if you were dating an idea for something, for example, during the day point, because they're going to do stuff and then you will naturally feel that anger bottled up inside of you, you're like, What are you doing? Like what? I always think as well, intelligence comes in the fact of the short term and long term. I can study words you might remember by kind of what was already the testimony about intelligence linked to long term and short term needs and succession goes in night. People do have more time. Intelligence.

 

Dr. Liz:
The march. Are you talking about the self discipline? One or what.

 

Jacob Lucas:
Happened? But I still study, but I read it ages ago. But it's people who are more intelligent. They they crave, crave. They seek the long term benefits, the people who are less intelligent always. I've done impulses and so benefits.

 

Dr. Liz:
Yeah the marshmallow test I mean is a good example of that is they put the marshmallows in front of the child. If you cannot eat this one, then when I come back you can have two and that's. Yeah. Yep. Good indicator of that. Self-discipline makes a big difference. And there has to be a level of intellect in order to have self-discipline in because you have to be able to think about that long term. The long term payoff.

 

Jacob Lucas:
Yeah. It's like when people cheat is opposed to reason. I speak about a couple of reasons I say, but one of them is an intellectual factor of on impulse. I feel only right now about sex and not think about the consequences down the line. If you have that kind of person, it's not going to work. If that person is more and it's like, What's the point? I'll see people cheat for different reasons. But I also want to come across is the short term, you know. So yeah, it's like I just think like the button main question effectively is yeah, we don't argue because there's nothing really.

 

Dr. Liz:
okay, that's.

 

Jacob Lucas:
There we go.

 

Dr. Liz:
Okay, Yeah.

 

Jacob Lucas:
Yeah. So that's the main thing that's been argued because there's a respect factor that is, that, is that really it's like we just think as well what we've been voting for up like that as well. Yeah. Like 100% like hope I'm sure my parents are quite strict but, but yeah.

 

Dr. Liz:
So was there open communication in your household growing up?

 

Jacob Lucas:
Yes. And my mom's a very intelligent woman. My mum, as you have, she has an IQ of a genius and she's a she's a psychotherapist as well. She's very smart, but my dad's is a good businessman. But pre not switched on with, like, emotions, if you will. But he's a very smart in his own regard with things and in the house always it was very much so if I'm good at something shut up and listen. And if you're good at something, I'll listen to you. You know, I've always had that mentality moving forward, like my my girlfriend, and she's better at something. I just listen, I'm not going to argue about it because. So Yeah, but that's what I would say. But if you follow in your own like they in life yourself, like.

 

Dr. Liz:
Well, I would have to swipe on somebody in order to have a dating life if you didn't realize that.

 

Jacob Lucas:
It was like nothing went on to take them.

 

Dr. Liz:
gosh, I yeah, it's been a while. I was dating dating like dating someone, but not necessarily like a first date of a dating like from a dating app That's been a very long time. Somebody who I was dating, we met in person. And so it was that more, you know, the natural like it's based on the energy and all of those things so.

 

Jacob Lucas:
Storage you're missing out on that. You could have.

 

Dr. Liz:
for sure. I mean, yes, I completely agree. But I the last time I hung out with somebody and I made it very clear like, hey, this is not a date. And so that so yeah, I always put that disclaimer on it too. So that might be kind of screw me up. But anyway, I don't like.

 

Jacob Lucas:
The route is not congruent with yourself, is it? If you're looking for relationship is not congruence, it's not going to work.

 

Dr. Liz:
But am I looking for a relationship? See, that's what I would probably if I was my therapist, that's probably what I would be putting back on me. Like, are you actually looking for a relationship? Because okay.

 

Jacob Lucas:
If I had a magic wand, I said, you could have the perfect husband right now. You would say, No.

 

Dr. Liz:
I would. The husband words got me cringing. But if you said, partner, I would like a yes because I don't want to be married again. But if you said yes, you could have perfect partner. Everything is perfect. Yeah. Yeah, you're right. Okay, Jacob, you win.

 

Jacob Lucas:
Yeah. So it's like you missed out. So many good stories. I think life is short as well. Like, just go for it. You might meet some amazing people. You might have the worst days of all time. I got food poisoning on a date. One of the worst. Like for.

 

Dr. Liz:
Us about that story.

 

Jacob Lucas:
Of was horrific. So my favorite were ages ago and I've been following you know, just talking normally I feel very you know what I just need to do a minute just for number one, like look up the stairs or they're like, I don't feel right. Anyway. And then food poisoning ensued and I was like, Fuck, How did you handle that? Yeah, So very weirdly. So anyways, so come downstairs from is like in the parties upstairs. I was like, I am fucked. I did not do it. So I need out of this situation. I got it fast. So she was sat there and I said, really? Where my thought just they. Why? My dad just called me. He needs help tonight. She needs help. Move in some furniture. She's like, What? they're like, Yeah, I need to go. So I'm really sorry. He's really old and he's going to hire him, so I need it. And she, like, so when I walked off anyway, and then it's a goodbye and blah blah, blah, and I was driving home, I thought, I can't do that to call girl chief, since I just absolutely paid her off. And just for the mob, the wrath effectively. So I called about halfway time through. I'll be honest with you, I got food poisoning like this brew. This is not good. And then she started laughing. She's like, What do you tell him? I was like, What would you tell her? You on the first date? Would you say it? I was I like Anyway, that was in the bath. So I went home and then.

 

Dr. Liz:
Took care of your food poisoning.

 

Jacob Lucas:
Mary died, so. And then? Then she went to see me. It was okay. So, like, it must have been really good point.

 

Dr. Liz:
You play that off well.

 

Jacob Lucas:
So I was like, Whoa, but what's your worst? What's your worst first day? That's interesting.

 

Dr. Liz:
I've got nothing for you. Like I. I genuinely have nothing you. I would say that the, the, the topic of conversation is, is the worst to me. I think that makes it a worse date for me when I'm not intrigued. Like, and that is what so frequently happens. And then like I was saying, the fucking red flag where you're talking about is that everyone talks about their trauma. And so I'm like, I'm not on the clock here, people, but I don't have anything like fun. I know, like people ask me that all the time. I'm like, I'm not like the fun single person who has, like all these stories to share. I mean, obviously after this conversation I will be because I clearly self-sabotage you.

 

Jacob Lucas:
You need a maverick.

 

Dr. Liz:
Okay? So someone like to go with me like a wing woman.

 

Jacob Lucas:
And then the maverick. Maverick means like some really unique, doesn't it? Like a maverick.

 

Dr. Liz:
like the partner I'm looking for yet?

 

Jacob Lucas:
Like you need someone who is out there because, like, your doctor, your, you know, you know, good looking. They switched on. A lot of guys get intimidated by you. You can get bored a lot. So if it guys talk to you about find out some people you want to kill yourself. Right. So it's like, yeah, but you got a guy, for example, we talked to you about on a philosophy or some of the interest in or whatever to some really different. Yeah, I guarantee you like that. But these kind of guys, this is all linking back to what you hold job for them on on dating apps you should just you quick because you're not going to be a maverick if you go for the finance bro or you go for like maybe like, that was like a typical like launch.

 

Dr. Liz:
What do you think I go for the what?

 

Jacob Lucas:
Like if you go for like, so it was like a normal job, for example, you know, a prestige job, like a lawyer or whatever. This is not like finance guy, whatever they aren't mavericks maybe one one of $100. But if you get someone who's like, for example, like just any of a normal job, that's when you that's when you meet the interesting people. Like I can imagine you wouldn't be bored of that. So I got I got I know people who like.

 

Dr. Liz:
Wait, is this where you, like, hook me up with somebody like it's.

 

Jacob Lucas:
An easy.

 

Dr. Liz:
Call.

 

Jacob Lucas:
Or crazy hook, You know? But you will see that so much more because I guarantee you, like you just 100%. I was at the house five high value women, high end, cheap women who ever go for fucking maverick because in that you just there would be no competition. Then give a fuck about competition. They don't care. They don't compete. They think they're more into like different things and they always end up treating women nicer as well.

 

Dr. Liz:
Okay. Well, I appreciate your free coaching today. No, I knew that was the direction we were going to go, but as you could see, the producer in the chat, she's thrilled by it and she's.

 

Jacob Lucas:
Wanting to say, I.

 

Dr. Liz:
Was very excited that you're going to find me a maverick to connect with.

 

Jacob Lucas:
So I'm glad I'm telling you that's the way that's the way to go. And like.

 

Dr. Liz:
she's telling us Operation Sign, Lizard Man. Okay, on that note, we are going to wrap this up so.

 

Jacob Lucas:
Late now, right?

 

Dr. Liz:
Where can people find you a social media website?

 

Jacob Lucas:
Yeah. So Jacob Lucas, one on one on TikTok and Instagram and website is Jacob Lucas day in dot com. So yeah. So follow me on if you want a 1 to 1 as well, let me know. But yeah, it'd be good but yeah fine for what. Fine for what? I guess.

 

Dr. Liz:
It's so you're saying if people want to work with you though, they can find you through your website, do that and.

 

Jacob Lucas:
They can publish your website. Or if you want to go on Instagram, I always I met every single person back on Instagram, so things that I can get lost in box because I don't do that, like, it's part of my day out to watch reply to people. So yeah, must be on the or the website or whatever. You must be over 18. Of course, the book. But yeah. So how do you find the data fun talking about this stuff or do you felt you felt judged? You know.

 

Dr. Liz:
No, not at all. I don't feel judged at all for anything. I encourage people to go find your website, but then also to find your social media because you give away a lot of great content that you're just putting it on your social media and lots of really good ideas of things that people really don't think about. And I think that that's, you know, our modern dating world. There's just so many red flags. There are so many things that we often aren't paying attention to. And so I think you provide a lot of great content around that, and I do not feel judged by you whatsoever. So I appreciate your insights on my self-sabotage.

 

Jacob Lucas:
Next time we talk, I want to know that you go on dates. You're wasting your time. You're not. Because if you're honest, I'm if you only take naps, you want to go with that, you that one.

 

Dr. Liz:
You care what you have to. I'm very much somebody of like quantity, so you have to give me like a very clear goal. So let's say if we talk in a month, how many dates do you.

 

Jacob Lucas:
Say in a month You get in a week easy. That's say let's say for if you can get a month, if you if you meet someone really good in first date on the first one, keep dating him but I'm telling you you'll got a lot to offer clearly. So it was like and you only that's what reason not you're not you're not doing it because you don't want to be you know and I'll tell you one of go for you don't look at don't look at what they do for living. Don't look at it.

 

Dr. Liz:
Okay. But am I allowed to look at what they look like?

 

Jacob Lucas:
Yeah.

 

Dr. Liz:
You got to give me something here.

 

Jacob Lucas:
Yeah. Look like just it.

 

Dr. Liz:
Can be attractive. Just don't worry about their job.

 

Jacob Lucas:
Don't worry about them.

 

Dr. Liz:
What if they say really stupid shit in their prompts? Am I looking past that as well?

 

Jacob Lucas:
You know, like if it's like, Yeah, but you've got to be interested about them, right? So yeah, just, just what I always said to everyone you talk to anyone, everyone. Because you're going to meet them like the diamonds you did not expect 100%. But as always, the ones you don't expect, that always end up being the best. Okay.

 

Dr. Liz:
Well, I appreciate the insights. I appreciate the accountability. I will talk to you in a month and I will Gon will have gone on four dates at that point.

 

Jacob Lucas:
So easy.

 

Dr. Liz:
All right, Jacob, great talking to you.

 

Jacob Lucas:
Take care.

 

Dr. Liz:
Thanks again, Jacob, for putting me and my dating life on blast today. And thank you all for tuning into this episode of relatable relationships, unfiltered. Make sure to subscribe to our YouTube channel and also give us a follow on Instagram at Dr. Elizabeth Fedrick.